Which brand has the worst customers?

"Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom" (will-alib) 01/06/2016 at 15:24 • Filed to: None

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Please indulge my stream of consciousness moment, fellow Opponauts. We talk a lot about superlatives here regarding cars and drivers, but what about customers? I was thinking back to college when I worked at a Saturn dealer in RI as a service writer, and recall the sales staff would have a get-together one evening at the end of the month for folks that had bought new cars that month. Now Saturn had a different way of doing things, so this kinda fit the profile. Thing is, after a while they noticed the same people kept showing up month after month for the free food & drinks. Even those that had bought used Saturns from us; one sales guy told me he’d seen the same guy & his wife show up 3 months in a row. Eventually the sales manager put the kibosh on it, and a good thing came to an end. Continuing with the “cheap basturd” theme, I had a few customers show up in service with no money on hand expecting to get their cars fixed. (without knowing if the fix was covered under warranty) When I explained they’d owe us for the diagnostic time if the fix wasn’t under warranty, I got blank stares. “Bbbbut it’s gotta be covered under the warranty!” Yeah, no... it doesn’t. After a while I realized being cheap was just part of the Saturn owner DNA. This can't be specific just to one brand though; what other makes have crappy customers?

FazeRacer > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 15:32

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Shall I say more?

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > FazeRacer 01/06/2016 at 15:36

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That falls under “worst drivers”, not “worst customers”.

I know... semantics.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 15:44

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*dons flame suit*

FCA minus Jeep. Jeep guys are usually good. But every other brand in that company has the most zealous owners who need to pathologically defend terrible cars.

Dart fanboi - THE DART GT IS BASICALLY A FIESTA ST! (paraphrased from a comment, and it isn’t) THE DART IS SO WELL REVIEWED! (actual quote, and it isn’t) EVERYONE LOVES IT EXCEPT YOU BECAUSE YOU BOUGHT A CAR THAT ISNT A DART SO YOU DON’T WANNA ADMIT YOU CHOSE WRONG! (amalgam of responses)

Challenger fanboi - NO MUSCLE CAR OUTHANDLES THE CHALLENGER, THEY SAY IT HANDLES BETER THAN A C6 VETTE! (actual quote, and NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPE)

Charger fanboi - THE CHARGER AWD IS THE MOST ADVANCED AWD SYSTEM ON THE MARKET! IT IS! ITS THE MOST MODERN CHASSIS TOO!!!! (actual quote, and see above)

General mopar fanboi - WELL CLEARLY YOU DIDN’ DRIVE THE (FCA equivalent to car being discussed) BECAUSE OTHERWISE YOU WOULD’VE BOUGHT IT! (not actual quote, but meh)

Even the “above average to good” cars in the stable are not really “class leading” but you can get good deals on them and they have their target audiences. FCA seems to be doing okay and like I said, Jeep is still crushing it. but pleeeeeeeease stop trying to pretend like the cars are all-stars from top to bottom. THey’re not.

Azrek > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 15:53

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The NFL? It got even worse with Fantasy Football.

As for Cars...worst customers has to be Toyota. I’ll go with that for the Prius alone. The nonsense with that battery POS drives me nuts.

“But we are saving the environment by driving around with 300 laptop batteries welded together in our trunk!”

GE90man > FazeRacer 01/06/2016 at 15:54

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ah... you beat me to it

Sneaky Pete > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/06/2016 at 15:57

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Viper ACR is not only class leading, it’s world leading.

Most of Dodge’s other cars (excluding the Hellcats) are lackluster.

FazeRacer > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 16:07

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There’s usually a correlation.

Gary Yogurt > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 16:09

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People are just awful, across the board. Even Saab owners can be awful.

TheAnswerIsAlwaysCitroën > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 16:14

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Just to play the devils advocate here: Cheap... Or poor? Yeah, abusing the system like that for free food is bad, but poverty can make people do things like that, even if they don’t like it.

Also, depending on the circumstances: If I took my car in with a problem I was convinced would be a warranty repair, and they then demanded that I show I have money to pay for the diagnostics, I’d probably be furious.

Shoop > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 16:18

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Geo

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Sneaky Pete 01/06/2016 at 16:24

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The viper ACR is the hideously fast exception..... and no one really cares besides people who can’t afford one thanks to a bottom of the barrel interior. Though it is glorious and brutal and doesn’t burst into flames when pushed, the viper is a sales failure. Speed alone in ACR trim doesn’t redeem it in the 100k+ club, apparently.

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > TheAnswerIsAlwaysCitroën 01/06/2016 at 16:28

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My guess is that if they were poor enough to need the free food they wouldn't have bought a new car. As far as the warranty goes, if you convince yourself it "should" be covered and it isn't, you can be pissed off but you'll still owe for diagnostic time and your car won't be fixed (if you don't have the $$)

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > Gary Yogurt 01/06/2016 at 16:29

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You mean Snaabs?

Sneaky Pete > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/06/2016 at 16:33

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You’ve obviously not been in a Gen V. The interiors are amazing. The ACR has also been selling like hotcakes, despite a 120k minimum pricetag.

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/06/2016 at 16:35

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Have you seen the new Viper's interior? Hand stitched leather w/alcantara inserts. Previous gen cars had cheap looking guts but not the current car.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Sneaky Pete 01/06/2016 at 16:45

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1) They’re good for a viper which isn’t the highest bar in the world (oh god the GTS ACR.....), but not 120k good. Not that that’s really the point of the car. It’s not a knock, it’s an observation on the focus of the ACR - hauling copious amounts of ass at ludicrous speed.

2) The VIPER is failing, even if the ACR sells. I have no doubt the low volume ACR is selling out of it s very limited run. ACR vipers always do that. But that doesn’t elevate the Viper as a whole. Why? I don’t know. I agree it is their best product.....and they can’t seem to sell it. For those of us on jalopnik and oppo who only care about some performance stuff, it looks great on paper. But it isn’t enough in that class. It’s missing a few things to be a true leader and make some good sales figures.

3) I’m going to cut you off before you try and say it’s actually selling well. It isn’t. Sales are still around 50 cars a month in the US. THe price cut at the end of 2014 had a dramatic effect.......for one month. 2015 ended with fewer vipers sold than when it was more expensive in 2014. Source: http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01/dodge-…

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 16:47

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Have you sat in an F-type? Have you sat in a 911? Have you sat in every other 90k+ car? They’re all really damn good. And the viper’s is nice.....but it’s more like 50-60k nice.

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/06/2016 at 17:15

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I recently spent a week with an F-Type R, so I'm familiar with that particular car. I don't see the Viper's interior as 2nd rate by comparison.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 17:40

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I have an opposite opinion. And so do many others, from the looks of sales. Not that it’s bad, it’s just boring and plain. Against the character of the car. It has decent materials and is assembled well enough. But that’s it. It lacks little details and touches. Oddly enough, it looks like an interior that has giant swaths of material, waiting for the holes and notches and whatnot where the controls for your features and luxury items go. And if the point of the car is that it *doesn’t* try to be a more luxurious car, then why pretend? The second gen viper smelled like a paint shop after 15 minutes in the summer, but it somehow worked.

Sneaky Pete > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/06/2016 at 17:45

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1) Please refrain from posting on subjects in which you have no first hand knowledge.

2) There are several factors that contribute to it’s lack of large sales numbers. Poor marketing, poor placement between the Vette and exotics price range, offered in manual only, etc.

3) Nice job googling. I know the non-ACR models aren’t selling well. I specifically mentioned the ACR. Reading comprehension.

nermal > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 18:55

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Kia or Hyundai.

As far as cars go, the current models are honestly quite good. On par with or better than the comparable Japanese / ‘Murican options. Every part of the chain after that, from the people that sell them to the people that buy them, is complete garbage.

No idea why.

The Compromiser > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/06/2016 at 18:57

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New money. New money’s kids. I would like to speak to the manager haircuts.

They all suck if you have to deal with them.

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > nermal 01/06/2016 at 22:30

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So Kia is today’s Saturn? Ok, I can see that..

Nauraushaun > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/07/2016 at 03:30

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Honda owners. I haven’t been on the receiving end of them as customers , but I’ve seen enough. There’s a reason everyone hates Hondas. It’s the owners. Hondas are fine cars.

Those who are in the market for a cheap-ish and sporty Japanese car and aren’t stupid tend to go for something that performs okay - RWD, maybe turbo-4 or 6-8 cylinder.

Those who want a sporty car but are idiots pick Hondas. They’re not usually very fast, and even when they are they’re FWD. But these people don’t really get it so they think their Honda is the best, fastest thing out of Japan.

And there’s your problem. Hondas aren’t bad, but the owners think they’re race cars built for the street. So they get a backlash.

Disclaimer: lots of generalizations in this post. It doesn’t apply to all Honda owners, but the reputation does come from somewhere - there’s a significant and very vocal group who fit this category. Yes, the S2000 and NSX are both RWD and fast, but they’re the two exceptions out of the last 30 years or something.

pip bip - choose Corrour > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/07/2016 at 03:33

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Subaru!

TheAnswerIsAlwaysCitroën > Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom 01/07/2016 at 06:44

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True, but you did write “Even those that had bought used Saturns from us” :)

As for warranty repair I’m fairly sure that at least where I live, when the car is under warranty it’s the dealer that has to prove the problem isn’t covered by warranty, not the other way round, and they can’t demand money for that investigation.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Sneaky Pete 01/07/2016 at 23:41

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1) I *have* been inside a fair number of cars above 80k. I stand by what I say. If I had that kind of $$$, and I was comparison shopping, my marks on the viper would remain “not up to class standards”. Deny all you want, it’s fact. And oh by the way, I actually used to be part of leather R&D for a tier 1 auto supplier. I actually know what hides and chemicals go into viper leather since we also supplied leather for the Jeep brand and the 300C. The viper hides are good. Same with the coatings. They’re the same as the ones for lexus and BMW sedans. But they’re not mind blowing. Not like the stuff we tried to use to get porsche/bentley business. Hell, bentley turned us down and we resubmitted for porsche and still got told “not good enough” and that was a nice step above the hides we prepped for lexus/FCA/BMW.

2) Let’s take your #1 and throw it back at you. DO you acutally know why? Or are you just guessing? Are you a marketer for an automotive company? Have you ever been in automotive at all?

3) And how about YOU learn to read. Re-read the start to my #2 - The VIPER fails even if the ACR succeeds. They make more than just the ACR, you know. So even with the supposed “success” of the ACR, the viper as a car is struggling. Snd if there is no base viper, then there is no ACR - success of one variant does not mean the model is safe. Porsche sold 10k 911s in north america in 2015. Jaguar sold 4500 F-types. Nissan regularly breaks 1000 sales of the GT-R. About the only “competitor” of sorts that the viper beat was the R8. Audi only moved 500 of them in 2015 which is unsurprising given its cost and age. It suffers from being low-tech, similar price,and slow/outdated/etc. And having sat in one.......ehhhhh.....it’s a nice A6? It drives way better than it looks and feels to sit in, I’m sure, just.......felt too Audi-ish. Too parts-bin. And the market is letting Audi know they need to roll out a new R8 or pull the plug.